Krieg und Energiekrise: Hofreiter zur "Realitätsanpassung" der Grünen | Markus Lanz vom 24.08. 202
eva quadbeck why actually the chancellor and deputy chancellor were still on this plane together yes the robot really also traveled solo to qatar yes that's right yes that was a chancellor's trip which means the deputy chancellor belonged was part from the java delegation not their trip and that was anyway it was something special they traveled to canada without stopping in washington first so a charm offensive to canadians we take you so seriously we came just for you then they came in a double pack and they actually wanted two things once this big hydrogen project starts what has now been signed and for that you really have to sign on to the government because it will be at the earliest in three years that year can go to the barn and that the federal government also rarely does anything about the day they are the future yes and that too in a situation where actually at home the cabin b run take two days to balance power for three four five years that's really accurate that's commendable for now the second thing they wanted is for the next few winters we get gas specifically from Canada through LNG terminals the trio didn't make a promise and that was not foreseeable that the trio or a promise they could give because he also has internal political pressure and havag suddenly had to do it because of course it is this energy that he is responsible for, so these contracts will also have to keep track of his responsibility, but he also came up as an ecological figurehead because the canadians had the suspicion ok the germans want to have our gas quickly and then no one invests in hydrogen and then there is the figure representing credibility i mean we are talking about fucking guest in canada we are talking mainly about fracking, we are we succeeded, how do you think that is very problematic?
But I mean the troublesome situation we find ourselves in right now all the time after all of us greens are now in favor of temporarily taking back coal power plants from the reserve and allowing coal power to be on. the plants are back to work the power plants and the plants around them are equipped with light diesel it is not exactly ecological either, but that is the drama of the war of aggression of russia against ukraine and it must be compensated with projects such as hydrogen, for example , through the further expansion of renewable energy and the further expansion in this area train due to a greater shift to electric mobility in the transport sector, bicycles, etc., but in the short term, due to this terrible war of aggression, now we are forced to do things that you could hardly have imagined before, but we would have to do more in the medium term and return as quickly as possible.
Basically I'm okay with a real one being absolutely plausible explaining which I'm going to find difficult if you're not really sure that in the medium term the expansion of renewables will work faster if you're not really sure that the traffic shift will be accelerated , that's what I think is much more problematic, we have achieved a few things, but when I look at Bavaria for example, now they have softened the 10a regulation, but there are still so many regulations, the distance of wind turbines ten times, so to say it, the diameter of the windmill says that of the house next door or exactly prevents it it is about the height diameter de facto prevents reasonable wind turbines in Bavaria or makes it very very difficult there are mayors in my district who are really behind with all his might everything just makes a lot very difficult and that's just a big problem what j now refuses and I recently had a conversation with the mayor who it is said that it does not have it for me or do you think how do you imagine that and about the situation in bavaria in terms of electricity it is very dramatic it is very current what ilse aigner has now also the 1st among the president of the state parliament is admitted yes no he was able to convince seehofer with his professional arguments at that time because the csu state government was totally delaying the expansion of the lines and blocked it so it is very difficult now also the electricity required from north to south in general so this decision, so to speak, not to build the route above ground but to build it underground yes, that was actually delayed forever, then there was a decision of the class around althaus seehofer exactly that makes of course a lot more expensive of course much slower for years yes of course yes and of all things this extremely energy intensive south of all things go to these r the south which consumes a lot of energy, basically put industrial companies at risk.
It was very popular back then. I can still remember that I was always in favor of power lines because I was rudely insulted and insulted partly by my own followers, but mostly by them. who broke away have told people how you can be a green levee yourself that seehofer is against and the free voters are against that they want nothing to do with it now somehow someone else was in government back then it's just now a big problem objectively objectively a problem and use of mail order so no reason to inhibit so if politically i mean csu management or something like that if bavaria has a problem all of germany has a real problem yes basically we all depend on an electricity market and if bavaria can't manage it then it has to yes the rest of germany supplies electricity that is clearly the question is is that possible in sufficient quantity because as I said, 3000 lines yes and Bavaria also has a special problem with gas storage tanks, otherwise that means there are already problems and of course Bavaria also behaves from time to time in public with the fact that the traffic light government policy everyone has to take that, of course, they would say that the traffic light does not take place yes, he always tries directly.
Sorry, get a bonus. they are home made, however of course you will have to win this solidarity within Germany, just like we Europeans show solidarity with each other which helps them to say that the problems are home made, they have to say that they are still they have health than me me and the spd is accused of what they did to russia but the csu was still just as bad for example bavaria has a dependency on russian gas which is the highest of all federal states in germany western so it's over 30 percent while energy for example also a big industrial country under ten percent and you haven't seen more taxes plus they're too putin are things that now we have at night and court, etc.
With the best of intentions, no one has anything bad up their sleeves, but that is the situation now before existence. How does the writer really see it? That I quoted you from the ambivalent of our time. What you are saying right now is reflected in a person like Anton.
hofreiter what does that mean so if you want to apologize i'm not that close but at his court rate he's 52 otto scily is 90 and that's g it's a bit about the party when chili was a year old the nazis took the power and when
hofreiter was born the second world war had ended 25 years ago and when the peace movement in germany was born it was just beginning and the green party was founded when i was ten years old and first came to the federal parliament when i was 13 and therefore Of course, it was a completely different party that came out of the protest that, as we know today, was absolutely necessary and outraged by all sorts of people and now that's what happens, so to speak, that really defines politics, so if you mean, the normative power of the factual, so if the facts change, opinion has to change and action has to change and you can study that very well with a court horseman because, so to speak, l he remnants of this protest party and this and this rebellion I think can still be seen in Mr.
Hofreiter's hair and beard but mostly he's still the same guy and just has to adapt like a lot of these members from the party now there is no other way there is no other chance and that is why I find you so interesting that on the one hand it is just how ambivalent these states have the view that coal is bad, nuclear power is even worse and , on the other hand, we have to think about it, we don't need it anyway and that's a very exciting thing, I don't think it ever existed. in politics like this before but that's because you have such strong opinions all the time and you couldn't walk away from them because I find one of the most interesting many still think you don't google for sure but the political modern you are Can I say that a man like Robert Fahrwerk where you can shoot even when he always notices that he fights with himself and tries to find the best solution and that's it? a whole new kind of politician that didn't exist before and i find him interesting and actually much more humane and forward looking than the old one so the question is of course when twitter is perceived as fickle, when will it becomes arbitrary. new, so to speak, one question is that they want, but on the other hand, we still have politicians who are also standing today and will ask tomorrow that yesterday they said yes, but that was already with Adenauer, so they told Adenauer that my babble stupid is all. about me yesterday, anja got a little smarter about it every day, politics demands it at the moment and none of us have people who have clairvoyant abilities, but none of us foresaw it, of course, he is pleased, he has all the reason, it was also the same in Bavaria. that the country has become dependent on russia but please that is also part of the truth back then people managed to change things through trade back then people believed that this dependency did not lead to bad things and back then putin it was a different guy that one also has to have the courage to be honest so that it wasn't bad intentions now it's different and now we have to make an effort to get it right but if all these decisions also these decisions in Canada will last for the next 30 years nobody knows if that can be a completely wrong thing too canadians in i don dont think they do but it could be that canadians are now investing in bringing gas to germany germany wants to have an energy shift to renewables as soon as possible possible in five years you won't need it anymore that could 1 1 Consequently, their Canadians are angry and so on, well, you don't know, in politics they like to be realm pretty basic entity in a series.
I do not agree, and what I do not think has changed in principle are the underlying objectives, so we have to adapt the energy transition due to aggressive warfare, but the objective remains, and in my opinion absolutely correct, that we have to emit and reduce CO2 as quickly as possible and that is why because of the war of aggression we now have to connect coal power plants to the grid in the meantime but to make the expansion of renewables even faster, that's why I would. I'm not saying that everything, so to speak, so completely adaptable would not have been happy if then the connections had remained, yes, like the problem of the climate crisis or, for example, we have also often discussed it here with the arms deliveries. if I also had the media nor what I mean for arms deliveries in a conflict with you, my values will still be much more fundamentally violated if we do not support Ukraine now, would it even be that? opinion that you can support yourself even more, i can only say mr hofrat, if you didn't say that and if you didn't have these basic values, you would have it, you want it and not a politician these basic values are the prerequisites for you that, so to speak, represent anything and that one has an opinion about it that is completely free that is not a year either the novel was misinterpreted by the public yes, but that is why I asked kurt beck in as an observer very intimately familiar with this political establishment in Berlin, as well as considering that it is true that we are all parents to such an extent that we would have to leave positions open because we need politicians here above all else who recognize the signs of the times and who are you sure Robert has someone who will too? does that Scholz so if then his tipping point speech think so and I also have the way he's driving the energy transition forward? bt even with a very high level of pragmatism there is no other way so you need to both recognize this sign of the times and then you also need political trade how do i get there maybe we talk about the gas system that is now that has always been Speaking of political art, something that was not so successful, but we must not forget that the Greens have also changed a lot.
Many of the Greens gained incredible numbers of party members during the time Berbalk and Harbeck were party leaders and that is too young. , generationpragmatic that has come in and that's why they don't have much to do with the Greens of the 70s anymore and if it comes to the issue of extending the running times of nuclear power plants then the party will definitely be divided there was a smaller part of the 60s to me its 65 in this context 60 to 70 is exactly 60 but green will melt again but we will survive that because 16 to 74 will have it harder so this The pragmatic generation of the middle generation that is closer to the green received fff youth Fridays so that the youth of the future could also w Everybody has big problems with that, but there is a very differentiated picture and I think the base of the Greens is also quite willing to participate in the latter because the industry also says that we need every percentage, even if it is so little, and here we are again with the issue of credibility and what is politically communicable cre or that it's not politically communicable that in the winter it's not just gas prices that will be electricity prices are also exploding because of the mechanisms we have in place in the morning, people won't understand that nuclear power plants will be shut down with the turn of the year and if you connect the operation of the cord with the fact that it says very clearly that this is not the exit of the exit, but it really works only because we overcome this winter, then I do not think that it is a betrayal of ideas though of course it is very difficult for the Greens to jump this stick after they have already had to compromise on coal and gas purchases around the world, which are not always politically correct, their
hofreiter prognosis will come from what I think which is just more time, longer run times, longer run times, firstly we try too hard and secondly it just depends on the results os, because for months the operators said it didn't work at all and they were afraid of that and now it will it's easy to get out of a test yeah and in my opinion this stress test puts the horse before the horse a bit, because actually you have to take a look first, we have the opportunity to continue to operate nuclear power plants with some degree of certainty, and this stress test has nothing to do with all the parameters, so we don't know if France has its nuclear power plants. you'll be able to let it run through the next winter by the time you're having problems with the cooling system a furnace has hairline cracks we also don't know if it has enough pure water to transport the coal to the power plants where the electricity is then generated we don't know none of that, that's why this stress test, from my point of view, is more like sonja and a show where you then have time to make these decisions or not to make them and that in turn is due to the fact that that not only has a teacher but also the chancellor also has someone who went to anti-nuclear rallies when he was young just had a big problem taking this step so route op is right it's not about runtimes anymore long in the feeling of lengthening for years but this route operation will come is by no means impossible if otherwise I would also do the stress test, but it must be said that we are in a crisis right now n problems with nuclear power it was not generated right now there is more gas than there has been for a long time and that is because french nuclear power plants are not working or a significant proportion of the power plants French nuclear is just old and corroded Because France has no money for new investment, the whole sector runs a high summer deficit.
This summer is mainly due to the fact that the rivers have warmed up too much, but very quickly. Yeah, what about nuclear power? of water and now you can in the massif of Saint Gotthard in Europe and massively and what has an exciting debate would be we are talking about an embargo on natural gas an embargo on oil an embargo on coal is a force we are talking about an embargo on more real things from Russia we are at least too dependent on it all over europe since in the other areas there were even exemptions for fuel to be flown to slovakia are already available Slovakia told us after the outbreak of the war that we cannot avoid it, we need these fuel elements from Russia , so it would be an exciting discussion to talk to Frankfurt or other countries if they would be willing to talk seriously. energy in the baroque extend this to russia also to the nuclear industry